93 Accord 2.2 Power Loss
 

Hello all! This is my first problem post and probably only my second post on this forum lol! Enough with the pleasentries lets get down to business.

The car runs great....most of the time. Just had all the motor/trans mounts replaced. No vibration anymore! The problem that I notice now that I can actually put some foot in the pedal is that when the car is cold it "shudders" randomly when accelerating...this happens for roughly 1-2 minutes. Not everytime but it is happening more often. After that 1-2 minutes the temp gauge needle EXPLODES to just over half from ice cold, then returns to its normal 1/3 - 1/2 position when warm and running. No CEL or codes noticed. Nothing happens after the "explosion". Car runs like the day it was new. Has 252,XXX miles on it.

I like this car but if i have to throw any more money at it my wife is gonna tow it to the scrap yard using my...as the tow strap:shrug:. Any ideas/help would be greatly appreciated!

Thanks for reading!

Humm, this is going to be a bit of fun.

First, the temp gauge would have me worried? Going from cold to "bam" over half and then down to a normal range. I hate throwing parts at things but I would replace the thermostat and see if that solves the one issue. Honda t-stats don't cost much more than aftermarket and is one of those things I would get from the dealer.

If the "shudder" is still there after solving the temp issue.

When was the last tune up (cap, rotor, plugs, inspect wires)?

When the car is cold you can open the radiator cap to make sure the water pump is spinning and moving fluid through the motor. Be careful thou do only when cold.

Also stated above It sounds like a lazy Tstat.

I would also let the car run in park for a while till hot to make sure the electro cooling fans are coming on

I took the Tstat out and put it in a pot on the stove....opens and closes as it should. After reinstalling the explosion is gone...maybe it had buildup in it somewhere. Water pump circulates...not sure if it is pumping as it should but I can see the coolant moving when the car is idling with the cap off. Noticed a lot of pressure on the upper and lower rad hoses....not sure what that means if anything but those hoses were like rocks with the cap on. I put irridium plugs, cap rotor button wires on a bout a year ago...might be time for another tune up. Noticed some oil around the distributor so it might be time for a new o ring or gasket or whatever goes in there but that's for another thread. Thanks for the replies. I'm starting to think it might be the ignition coil. The power loss is quite frequent now and more power loss. I had to drive my little frontier to work today. I'll repost after the coil is put in.

I'm glad you got the heating issue fixed. And is your motor a vtec motor. Because there's a vtec silinoid that usually leaks oil around the distributor. And I had some power loss issues a while back with mine. I did all the tune up issues and still didn't work. I ended up putting a new fuel filter on and it cured everything. Mine was so clogged it was bearly getting gas. Low fuel pressure. I would change that and see if it helps. Even if it does help it's a maintance issue that needs done eventually. Also pull your spark plugs and check the gap on them make sure their gaped right and check how their burning. The color of them will tell you alot. If it's rich or lean or burning oil or burning too hot or whatever. Post a pic of them and we can probably help if you don't know

Runs in park just fine but now I have the opposite problem...20% heat at max. I will replace the tstat asap. issue one down. thanks for your input! next problem is power loss. I pulled the cap off...there is a very minute amount of oil in/around the dist. so i doubt that would cause what im noticing....while on that subject...it seems to be only in the low rpm....maybe 10% throttle or lower that i notice the power loss. after that all is good. am I alone in thinking its the coil? thanks again for all your help!!! I look forward to hearing from yall

Soupy Octane

edit** I will try to find the time to pull the plugs and snap some pics this weekend. I am moving this week so its gonna be tough. when i bought the irrid plugs they said do not gap all over them....any clue what they would be gapped at?...pretty sure they are bosch irridium plugs.

it is NOT vtec! i havent checked the fuel filter...i bought the car from a doctor i work with who has owned it since 77k miles....where is the FF located?

Random question...I was thinking about a few other issues the car has....is it unsavory to post them here? should I post another thread?

You can post them on this thread. They may be relevant to your problem.

Was the car shuddering before the mounts were replaced? Problems when you are at idle or just opening the throttle would point towards vacuum issues like a maybe a vacuum leak. A bad coil would cause problems all the time and not just at low idle, IMO.

Iridium plugs have very brittle posts that snap off if you try to enlarge the gap
Also, I have yet to find that whatever s. p. gap has any impact on driveability.

Oil in the distributor has screwed up driveability in both Accord and
Nissan Altima cars. It gets worse with time, quickly ... disabled at edge of road.

luck.

EGR port blockage can cause poor acceleration from 1500-2000 rpm. Too much EGR is some port and none in others results in "lean stumble". Note, this would only happen when fully warmed when EGR flow is enabled.

Vibration under acceleration is also a characteristic of worn CV jts. Looseness allows joint to rotate "off center" and vibrate. New CV axles are cure. See my thread on this problem. I went through 4 Autozone axles before installing Raxles which cured the problem. Apparently it takes only a small amount of looseness to cause the vibration. This vibration is most notable on accelerations from slow speed or start, but will occur at higher speeds under heavy acceleration.

good luck

You mentioned Bosch plugs. I've heard people talk about misfiring with Bosch plugs in Hondas. To be honest, I used to use Bosch & didn't have problems, but who knows??

NGK & Denso are the favorites.

I would still do a fuel filter just because. It's cheap and was the part I replaced to fix my issue after hundreds of dollars in ignition and everything else....... With 250k miles and if it was never replaced. It needs done anyways. And is it a stock cat converter still?

Both my cat converter and fuel filter went bad around 160K miles. I had bad power loss.

With 250k on the car I would start looking at the oldest stock parts that hasn't been serviced yet

I'm a part of this mess, but let's see ...

oil in distributor,
EGR blockage
worn CV joints
wrong brand of spark plugs
fuel filter
catalytic convertor.

Before you follow our advice, you need to rent/watch
the oldish movie "They Shoot Horses, Don't They?"



This is only partly in jest ...

Most of this can be test free of charge to narrow down the problem so we can better help diagnose the problem.

oil on distributor can be cleaned and see if there is a difference

Egr ports can be tested to see if there is a issue. Hold the egr valve open while car is running if the car dies then your egr ports are open. If no change their clogged

Worn CVs can be inspected and tested with jacking the car up in neutral and rotating it at hard angle and check for play

Fuel filter can be tested by testing the fuel pressure at the fuel rail

Catalytic converter can be tested with a smog tester and also a heat gun while running to see if it's the correct temp. If it's too hot it's clogged up

The spark plug thing is the only part you will have to buy to see if their is a issue.

I would go over these things before you go buying parts

Best of luck and report back so we can help. If u need help performing any of these tests in detail . Post here or PM me

As I continue to drive "Ol Reliable" to work and back a few more things are standing out as potential causes to my power loss. First red flag is MPG. I usually get around 25 - 31 MPG back and forth to work. I am now at 15-18 MPG. FULL Tune up is coming soon. New plugs and fuel filter especially. *Also* i havent seen a thread on my fuel sending unit but it always reads empty. i know where the access port is and how to uninstall but before I get that far how can I tell if it is the sending unit or the dash display? Thanks everyone for your input on my issues. It's nice to be able to reach out for help without paying someone to look at it.

I will make time this weekend to throw some $$$ at this old thing. My wife gave me $150 budget to fix the problem. If I can't find and fix it, she wants it gone. (She wants a $40k truck and I dont want to pay for it....impossible budget for car = new truck lol)

*EDIT* Priced a tune up at $135 without the fuel pump strainer or sending unit. YEESH! I need a $15 fix if this doesnt work hahaha!

Forum has seen occasional car w/ drivability issues resolved by a new O2 sensor. If your's is over 100K miles old, this might be worth a shot.

If EGR system has not been cleaned before, it's a virtual certainty to be partially (this causes flat spot in acceleration) or completely (no symptoms) blocked.

good luck

lmfao

Fuel gauge can be tested by shorting correct pins at the fuel level sensor connector in trunk. Download a 90-93 shop manual to be sure to get correct pins. From a 90 Accord manual, the wire colors were blk (grnd) and yel/wht.

When you short connector, you need to turn keyswitch to On watch whether the gauge is moving towards full and immediately turn keyswitch Off. If you allow gauge to peg against stop it may be damaged.

If gauge moves, the fuel level sensor is the problem. If not, the gauge movement is suspect.

good luck

Did the sudden jumping of coolant temperature go away?

I would suggest using NGK ZFR5F-11 plugs that are copper electrodes and run about $2 each. A former moderator and Honda technician would always post that the platinum and iridium plugs caused problems in older accords.

I'd probably replace the air filter. What spark plug wires are on there and how old? OEM wires seem to last forever.

Clean the EGR ports.

Check for engine and transmission codes.

Inspect the distributor cap and rotor, replace with Honda parts.

The plugs, air filter, and cap/rotor should cost around $50.

Do some testing before throwing parts at it.

^X2. This is really sounding like a lazy O2. Not a fan of throwing parts at an issue but the makers of O2 sensors will tell you that they are good for ~100K then go down hill from there. These should have a replacement time/age/miles like many other things IMHO.