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Gearing up for a painful stereo install

  #1  
Old 10-03-2007, 03:40 PM
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Default Gearing up for a painful stereo install

I just got an 05 Accord EX V6 5AT, and decided to do IASCA SQ competitions with it. Before getting the car, I had decided on an Alpine w205 deck so I could use a Blackbird II with it, and with Hybrid Audio L8 8" speakers in the doors, L4 4" mids in the kicks, and L1 tweets in the factory location. I knew it had been done before in 98-02 Accords, so surely it wouldn't be much trouble on the newer body style, right? WRONG.

The only real option ot put an aftermarket deck in is to remove the pocket underneath the factory deck, which is really out of the way, so that was out. Fine, I can use LOCs to run to an Alpine 701 to control everything, no problem.

Then, I get to looking at the kicks. The fuse panel and hood pop are all on the driver's side. I have no clue where to move that panel out of the way.

Doors look to be shape molded to fit something that's 6" diameter max. Since the 8's will be doing midbass from about 50-150Hz, I'm not too worried about the grill covering some of the cone, but I have no clue if I can even get them mounted in there. They have a 3.6" mounting depth.

The only thing on this install that still looks solid is tweeter install. I'm going to cut a hole in the top of the grill covers and mount the tweeter so it sits flushon top of the factory grill. Then, I'll cover the whole thing in Black acoustically transparent grill cloth. There's a seam around the factory grill between it and the dash, so the fit should be just about perfect.

So, my biggest questions are:

1. How do you remove the doors? Where do I pull, where are screws?

2. Any suggestions on relocating that fuse panel on the driver's side?

3. Does anyone know the mounting depth inside the door?

I had a 96 Civic before this and ripped it apart so many times I can do it in my sleep, but this car is a lot newer and a lot nicer. I really don't want to screw something up on this.
 
  #2  
Old 10-03-2007, 03:48 PM
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Default RE: Gearing up for a painful stereo install

I saw a post today with a pretty nice install kit to give you a DIN opening. I don't recommend trying to relocate a fuse panel ..... very difficult. Look on Crutchfield for products that fit the depth for comparison. On my 2000 EX V6, there are two screws, one in the door handle and one behind the release. There's a plastic "clip", more like a plug near the side view mirror and clips around the sides and bottom. Then it lifts over the lock post and you have to unplug the corner light. I wouldn't expect the next generation to be much different if at all.
 
  #3  
Old 10-03-2007, 03:53 PM
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Default RE: Gearing up for a painful stereo install

gotcha.

yeah that single din kit got some pretty crappy reviews.

on the fuse panel, it must be moved. i know it's doable, just gotta get down in there and look. it's just easier if someone else has already done it and can tell me which direction to go with it.
 
  #4  
Old 10-03-2007, 03:57 PM
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Default RE: Gearing up for a painful stereo install

If that's what you gotta do, by all means ..... that is what is going to make this install hard though. In building renovations, I do whatever possible to avoid having to move electric panels. Maybe there's a way to get it into the side of the dash like my 6th gen. Good luck!

BTW - MacLeod is the resident expert on A/V systems. Try talking to him.
 
  #5  
Old 10-03-2007, 06:34 PM
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Default RE: Gearing up for a painful stereo install

Oh boy, where to start. Son you came to the right place. Im currently in my 8th month of trying to get this gawdawful car to sound good in SQ comps.

The only real option ot put an aftermarket deck in is to remove the pocket underneath the factory deck, which is really out of the way, so that was out. Fine, I can use LOCs to run to an Alpine 701 to control everything, no problem.
This is the best place. I got the kit from Crutchfield and stuck my hu in there and it works like a charm. Another cool thing about it is the 701's remote can be wedged into the cubby right under the HU and it fits perfectly and wont move but is easy to take out and use while tuning.

Then, I get to looking at the kicks. The fuse panel and hood pop are all on the driver's side. I have no clue where to move that panel out of the way.
Yup, unless youre ready for a LOT of time consumed, not much you can do with those kicks.

Doors look to be shape molded to fit something that's 6" diameter max. Since the 8's will be doing midbass from about 50-150Hz, I'm not too worried about the grill covering some of the cone, but I have no clue if I can even get them mounted in there. They have a 3.6" mounting depth.
The doors barely have 2" of clearance before you hit the window. Second, that hole wont fit any 6.5 without at least a 1" spacer but youll still have to cut open the hole cause its so small that it chokes off the venting for the speaker. I went with 5.25's and STILL had to use a 1/2" spacer!

The only thing on this install that still looks solid is tweeter install. I'm going to cut a hole in the top of the grill covers and mount the tweeter so it sits flushon top of the factory grill. Then, I'll cover the whole thing in Black acoustically transparent grill cloth. There's a seam around the factory grill between it and the dash, so the fit should be just about perfect.
NOOOOOO!!! This not the best place by a longshot! The best place is on the A pillars but low. My tweeters are in the dash and I hate them but I cant fiberglass and the A pillars are too small for cutting a hole and mounting tweeters there, Im kinda stuck with them for now. Your imaging will suffer GREATLY with them there. It took me months to get a solid image and female voices still flutter around a bit.

1. How do you remove the doors? Where do I pull, where are screws?
1 screw is in the grab handle. Pull up the rubber piece and youll see it. 2 more are located behind the door handle. Look closely and youll see a little clip on the rear facing side. Pop this out and youll see the 2 screws. After that, take off the sail panel. Then pry out the window/door lock control panel and disconnect it. After you pull out all the poppers youll have to disconnect the door release cable from the back of the door handle.

2. Any suggestions on relocating that fuse panel on the driver's side?
I say forget about kick panels. Have you thought about using the Hybrid 3's and putting them in the stock tweeter locations?? This could take some fabricating but it would be easier than moving fuse boxes and it would give you primo stage height!

3. Does anyone know the mounting depth inside the door?
2" at best. Youre probably going to have to use 6" midbass drivers with a 1" spacer but make sure you cut out the hole so it has plenty of room to breath.

By the way, are you on Team Hybrids? I have several buddies on that team. Scott Buwalda is a great guy and a car audio genius and led those guys to SEVERALIASCA world championships this year.
 
  #6  
Old 10-03-2007, 08:49 PM
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Default RE: Gearing up for a painful stereo install

Awesome, thanks for the heads up! Were you at NOPI Nationals in Atlanta? I was walking around with Andy Jones.

No, I'm not a member of team hybrids, but have talked to several of them. I'm going to try and compete in rookie class this upcoming year. I've been talking to Scott a lot, hoping to get on the team. However, after what you said, I'm not sure if that's doable with this car. Are you on DIYMobileAudio.com or sounddomain?

Anyways, after some serious thinking, I'm going with the factory deck with LOC to the 701.

Also, I'm going to start off with a 2 way, L6 in the doors, L1 up top.

On the tweeters, I considered a-pillars, esp since they're already covered, but the dash locations seemed easier and Kirk Proffit's Acura TL has them on the dash. I planned on mounting the tweets above the grill to give a little bit more height and help with imaging and location.

On the pillars, I figured I can just remove the cloth, cut a hole, anchor the tweet, and recover with grill cloth. Yes/No/Maybe?

I'm still in the air on whether or not to go with Raammat or SecondSkin for deadening. Opinion?

To date, I haven't become a member of IASCA, but I will be soon so I can get a copy of the rule book and make sure I don't miss anything when anchoring the wires.

Also, where can I get 1/0 through the firewall? And how much hell am I in for when I try to run speaker wire through the doors? I figured I'd get some 16 gauge 4 channel speaker wire so there'd only be one wire to go through the plug.

Thanks so much for the help, and let me know of any other suggestions.
 
  #7  
Old 10-03-2007, 09:31 PM
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Default RE: Gearing up for a painful stereo install

Awesome, thanks for the heads up! Were you at NOPI Nationals in Atlanta? I was walking around with Andy Jones.
No I wasnt at NOPI but Andy is a friend of mine and we're on Team Schil Acoustics together. No better dude in car audio!

No, I'm not a member of team hybrids, but have talked to several of them. I'm going to try and compete in rookie class this upcoming year. I've been talking to Scott a lot, hoping to get on the team. However, after what you said, I'm not sure if that's doable with this car. Are you on DIYMobileAudio.com or sounddomain?
Have you thought about competing in MECA? They classify competitors by vehicle mods so youll be competing with guys with the same mods as you.

Anyways, after some serious thinking, I'm going with the factory deck with LOC to the 701.
One word bro - NOISE! The 701 is very noisey with anything but an optical out. Im running the AI-net cable and I still have some. If youre going to go that route, I highly suggest the JL Audio Cleansweep.

On the tweeters, I considered a-pillars, esp since they're already covered, but the dash locations seemed easier and Kirk Proffit's Acura TL has them on the dash. I planned on mounting the tweets above the grill to give a little bit more height and help with imaging and location.
Kirk is also on Team Schil Acoustics and Im here to tell ya, that guy has a gift! I dont know how he makes those locations sound as good as he does. Not only is he anoutstanding tuner and he's also using about $5,000 in Zapco amplificaiton, $2000 in Seas speakers and a couple grand in Fi subs. Bottom line is just because he's making them work doesnt mean us mere mortals can.

On the pillars, I figured I can just remove the cloth, cut a hole, anchor the tweet, and recover with grill cloth. Yes/No/Maybe?
Maybe the L1's can work. My Polk ring radiator tweeters are very directional so they just dont work well in the dash. Best thing to do is to stick them in various spots and see which place images and sounds best but Id be willing to be that the best spot will be low on the pillar and firing to the opposite headrest.

I'm still in the air on whether or not to go with Raammat or SecondSkin for deadening. Opinion?
Both are excellent but the Raammat is much cheaper. Id go with it.

To date, I haven't become a member of IASCA, but I will be soon so I can get a copy of the rule book and make sure I don't miss anything when anchoring the wires.
Again, check out MECA. Both Andy and Kirk are very active in MECA along with the rest of Team Hybrids as well as Team Zapco. Georgia finals are this Sunday in Dawsonville and Tennessee finals are in Nashville in a couple weeks. World finals will also be in Nashville November 16-17.

Also, where can I get 1/0 through the firewall? And how much hell am I in for when I try to run speaker wire through the doors? I figured I'd get some 16 gauge 4 channel speaker wire so there'd only be one wire to go through the plug.

Thanks so much for the help, and let me know of any other suggestions.
There is a rubber grommet on the drivers side of the firewall. You can fish wire thru there and it will pop out from behind the center part of the dash. This is the easiest car to run power wire Ive ever seen. I did it from battery to trunk in 5 minutes.

The doors are a whole other story. Yes youre in for a lot of pain and agony. There is a way but its rather drawn out and Im tired of typing so when you get to that part, give me a shout and Ill talk ya thru it.
 
  #8  
Old 10-03-2007, 10:27 PM
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Default RE: Gearing up for a painful stereo install

thanks for the info. I had considered MECA, but didn't know the requirements.

On the 701, I had considered the cleansweep, but didn't know if it was really necessary. If it'll help take the noise out, then it's done. Any good suggestions for temp mounting tweets for testing? On a side note, the pillar flattens out near the very bottom by the windshield. Would that be too close to tame, or is it better since it's farther away? I've always been SQ oriented in my installs, but in no way have the ears to tune for the cars I heard at NOPI. Any input on locations you can give would be great.

Finally, how far do you think I could go with a 2 way setup up front? I don't think I could win semi-pro with it, but maybe rookie.

Oh, and I'll be in Nashville in November for the MECA show. Will you have your accord?
 
  #9  
Old 10-04-2007, 05:58 PM
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Default RE: Gearing up for a painful stereo install

ORIGINAL: Thumper26

thanks for the info. I had considered MECA, but didn't know the requirements.
The requirements are much more relaxed than IASCA. In MECA its simply get in and listen. No install, no speaker blowing RTO, no points for showmanship - just pure sound quality which is what its all about. They do have seperate competition classes for install and RTA if you choose.

On the 701, I had considered the cleansweep, but didn't know if it was really necessary. If it'll help take the noise out, then it's done.
It will help dramatically. The Clean Sweep will flaten the output of the stock head unit and then boosts it thru an 8 volt line driver to the amps. That should be enough to get the noise floor up high enough that it shouldnt be an issue. But you gotta remember, the 701 is a noisey beeyotch running analog so there will always be some.

Any good suggestions for temp mounting tweets for testing?
Those Hybrid tweets are about the size of a quarter LOL! Some 3M double sided tape should work just fine.

On a side note, the pillar flattens out near the very bottom by the windshield. Would that be too close to tame, or is it better since it's farther away?
I am a firm believer in keeping the tweeter as far away as possible. For my Polk tweets, this spot worked best. I cant say for sure how the L1 will work.

I've always been SQ oriented in my installs, but in no way have the ears to tune for the cars I heard at NOPI. Any input on locations you can give would be great.
Im only in my second year so Im still pretty green myself. The best way to learn is how I did - attend as many shows as you possibly can, talk to as many high level competitors as you can and most importantly listen to as many high level cars as you can.

Finally, how far do you think I could go with a 2 way setup up front? I don't think I could win semi-pro with it, but maybe rookie.
Im a firm believer in 2 ways. The simpler the better. The less speakers you have the easier it is to get everything working together. Just ask Gary Biggs. 7 time IASCA world champion using a 2 way JBL 5.25 component set and single 10" sub. In SQ, the simpler the better.

Oh, and I'll be in Nashville in November for the MECA show. Will you have your accord?
Yup. Ill be there.
 
  #10  
Old 10-04-2007, 08:10 PM
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Default RE: Gearing up for a painful stereo install

Great to hear. I'll be checking it out. I've decided to go with an all Dynaudio set in the car. I have to call a couple of dealers tomorrow to see what that's going to cost me.

On your pillars, did you take them out to look at them? If so, how'd you do it?
 

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