Hi all,
I'm a newbie to the forum from the UK hoping for some help in finding a fault that could be fuelling.

I have a year 2000 Accord coupe 2000cc petrol. For about a year and a half I have had an intermittent problem that occurs sometimes twice a week, but then maybe not again for 2 months. It does not happen very often!

Basically the engine will cut out when I am driving along. If I try to start it again immediately it will not start. But if I leve it for one minute before trying, then it will always start immediately.

In a seperate incident today, I returned from a two week holiday and tried to start thE car, but it wouldn't start (and still won't). The engine is turning, there is a spark, but it appears that there is no fuel.

Normally when the ignition lights come on the dash before starting the car, I hear a buzz from the fuel pump, which ends after about 2 seconds at the same time as a click. Neither sounds are currently audible.

Is there any way to tell for sure if it is a fuel pump problem or a relay problem? Anyone know which one is the fuel pump relay?

A breakdown guy came out to look at it this afternoon and after doing some checking, he thinks it is either a pump or a relay. But he doesn'y know which is the correct relay for the pump. He says that the pump has an electrical feed, so thinks it is not a relay problem.

The connector on the fuel tank has five pins in a pair and a three. Which ones are for the pump?

There is a public holiday in UK on Monday so all garages and suppliers will now be shut until then. But I could try to get a used part from a breakers on Sunday or Monday if I know which ones to get.

I'm sorry for such a long post, but I thought that more information helps. If anybody can offer any help or advice this would be much appreciated.

Thanks

Peter

 

Download 98-02 shop manual from online manuals link in the DIY section.

You will have to figure out which wire color feeds 12V to the fuel pump. Then unplug that connector, touch the volt meter + lead to the 12V wire and the volt meter - lead to a ground bolt. Turn the key to the II position and see if there is 12V for about two seconds during the clicks.

 

Thanks for your quick reply.
I'll have a look at that online manual link. The confusing thing is that there doesn't seem to be the usual clicks. Could a faulty pump cause the clicks to not occur?

I've now identified and removed the main relay for examination / test. It has the label siemens VRM-0022. I've checked all the contacts with a resistance meter and there don't appear to be any bad joints. The contacts in the two relays appear to be free to move and the springs are still in place and functioning properly.

Do you have a link for an electrical test for the relay? I have found one link, but it is very confusing. It shows pin numbers that do not match mine and I can't figure out how to do it.

Thanks
Peter

 

I can't find a link for 98-02 shop manual, but I can find a link for "Ab0VE Honda Accord ESM 98-00 CD ISO zip" on hondatech.info . Is this the one you mean?

Peter

 

Try starting your car at different times of the day. If its a main relay issue, most of the time it wont start if its hot and is more likely to start at night when its much cooler.

 

Thanks for the advice. I was trying on and off all throughout yesterday afternoon and evening, and today it's cool and cloudy (about 15 C, I should think) and still no luck. So maybe not the relay after all.

I'm going to call a few breakers to see if any has an accord fuel pump or main relay that I could try. Does anybody know which models share the same fuel pump as mine? (I've got a 2.0 accord coupe year 2000).

 

At the fuel tank, the connector has five pins - A line of three and a line of 2. I have figured out that the line of three pins is for the fuel guage and the line of two is for the fuel pump.

For the pump, I can see which one is grounded, and I have checked the other one to see if it goes live for 2 seconds when the key is turned. It does not go live. I attached an external 12v supply to the pump wires for a couple of seconds and the pump buzzed! Yay!. So I disconnected the supply, then tried to start the car. It started easily and ran for about 1 second, then stopped (because the fuel pump was not running). So the fuel pump is not the problem.

So, thinking about the main relay, I understood that it controlled other things as well as the fuel pump, like the injectors. Is this true?

If the car runs when the fuel pump is powered from an external supply, does this mean that the main relay cannot be faulty?

As a temporary measure to get motoring again, I could rig up a supply to the fuel pump. Would this be a bad idea? My drive to work is about 15 miles on country roads.

 

I just answered your other post, but this one has more information. It really sounds like a bad main relay.

Yes, the main relay switches power to the injectors, but that's a 2nd physical relay inside the same plastic case. So that doesn't prove the main relay is OK.

Not a bad temporary idea to run power directly to the fuel pump. But ONLY TEMPORARY. One safety feature is when the ECU doesn't see a tachometer signal it will shut off the fuel pump. For example after a collision.

 

Hi Jim,
Thanks for your advice. I drove the car to the breakers today 15 miles each way and it drove fine with the temporary supply to the fuel pump. I will definitely replace the temporary supply as soon as I can.

I found two accords at the breakers, both the same model type as mine (6th gen, I think), but neither had the same main relay as mine. (Mine is a coupe (USA built?), but the ones at the breakers were saloon (4 door) and hatchback (5 doors) (both UK built?))

Mine has the markings "Siemens VRM-0022 USA". I have the engine type F20B capacity 2000cc.

Both the accords at the breakers had the same main relay, which had the markings:
"Pektron
Relay Assy Main,
39400-S1A-G010
A-0308G03
England 12V"

One of the cars had an F18B2 engine 1800cc, the other had an F20B 2000cc.

I am now wondering if I could use a main relay from one of the cars at the breakers in my own car. The plug connector looks the same, even though the box is bigger in the cars at the breakers. (I have them both).

I followed the test procedure for my own relay on the relays from the breakers and they passed all the continuity tests. My own relay failed the first test, so I gave up testing it.

On final query: While driving the car with the temporary supply to the fuel pump, I noticed that the cruise control would no longer work. Could this problem be linked to a faulty main relay, or could it mean that I have dislodged some wires while I have been fiddling with the main relay?

Regards

Peter

 

I don't think the cruise control is related to the main relay, so you probably dislodged some wiring.

I bet that main relay will work, but not absolutely sure. I don't have the wiring drawings to compare. But it passed the continuity tests, so that's a pretty strong indication that it'll work.

You could also repair yours with a soldering iron. Open the plastic case & re-melt the solder joints on the circuit board.