Honda Noob
#1
09-04-2011, 08:33 PM
Honda Noob
Hello from NE Ohio..
I am not a mechanic. The only tools I own are a hammer, screwdriver & tire gauge. I'm quick but when it comes to the mechanical operations of what does what, I'm clueless..
I purchased a new (used) 99 Honda Accord EX Coupe (3.0L SOHC 24V VTEC V6) it has 89300miles on it. Absolutely love this car til' it rained one day.. Was told to replace the distributor cap & rotor due to moisture. Of course I did this when it was dry, sunny & warm outside. It was purring like a kitten yesterday. Everything was fine & dandy, then it rained again (today) & we are due for rain ALL week..
The car will crank, the green key in the dash flashes but shuts off. All of the electrical works properly. When the rain dries up, the car will start. It's frustrating b/c I just acquired this car and I was told to get the throttle body cleaned, which I did & now this.. It's one thing after another.
I am not a mechanic. The only tools I own are a hammer, screwdriver & tire gauge. I'm quick but when it comes to the mechanical operations of what does what, I'm clueless..
I purchased a new (used) 99 Honda Accord EX Coupe (3.0L SOHC 24V VTEC V6) it has 89300miles on it. Absolutely love this car til' it rained one day.. Was told to replace the distributor cap & rotor due to moisture. Of course I did this when it was dry, sunny & warm outside. It was purring like a kitten yesterday. Everything was fine & dandy, then it rained again (today) & we are due for rain ALL week..
The car will crank, the green key in the dash flashes but shuts off. All of the electrical works properly. When the rain dries up, the car will start. It's frustrating b/c I just acquired this car and I was told to get the throttle body cleaned, which I did & now this.. It's one thing after another.
#3
09-04-2011, 10:30 PM
How about your plug wires ? Some thing you can try is putting your car in a dark garage , get a spray bottle with water , open your hood , start the car then spray your plug wires lightly . See if you get some arcing. If a garage is unavailable try it after dark.
Last edited by XCR600; 09-04-2011 at 10:32 PM.
#4
09-04-2011, 11:55 PM
Who told you to change the cap and rotor?
I just think it's strange to suspect that given your symptoms. Unless the cap was physically cracked or there was some other defect with it, I don't see how moisture has anything to do with those. Seems like throwing money at the problem. Even then the cap and the distributor housing itself both have holes that allow moisture and air to get in to begin with.
I also wonder what your actual problem is. You don't explicitly state what your problem is. It seems like it's an intermittent no start right? Like XCR600 said, try the wires if you think the moisture is involved.
I just think it's strange to suspect that given your symptoms. Unless the cap was physically cracked or there was some other defect with it, I don't see how moisture has anything to do with those. Seems like throwing money at the problem. Even then the cap and the distributor housing itself both have holes that allow moisture and air to get in to begin with.
I also wonder what your actual problem is. You don't explicitly state what your problem is. It seems like it's an intermittent no start right? Like XCR600 said, try the wires if you think the moisture is involved.
Last edited by MessAround; 09-05-2011 at 12:01 AM.
#5
09-05-2011, 07:31 AM
Does sound like an intermittent no start. I would want to narrow down to lack of spark or fuel. Next time this happens, try spraying tb cleaner directly into the tb, does it start?
Based upon your post (hammer, screwdriver, tire gague), testing for spark might be difficult...a spare spark plug inserted into the wire and ground it, timing light.
Last, happen to replace the o-ring under the dist cap?
Based upon your post (hammer, screwdriver, tire gague), testing for spark might be difficult...a spare spark plug inserted into the wire and ground it, timing light.
Last, happen to replace the o-ring under the dist cap?
#6
09-05-2011, 08:54 PM
{I am not a mechanic. The only tools I own are a hammer, screwdriver & tire gauge. I'm quick but when it comes to the mechanical operations of what does what, I'm clueless..} It was a joke, I was basically saying that I am not mechanically inclined. I wasn't planning on using a hammer or screwdriver to get my car started.
1 mechanics told me to change the distributor cap/rotor, the other told me to clean the throttle body. AutoZone told me to change the sparkplugs & NAPA told me to change the coil.
For those confused, the car simply will NOT start when it is rainy, rains or just finished raining outside. I am a female, this is my first Honda. I am NOT dating a mechanic, therefore, I have to go to a forum & ask questions to the best of my knowledge. Going to AutoZone is costing me more money & the 2 mechanics I took my car to, are of no help. I'm sorry that I confused anyone w/my post.
Thank you XCR600 & poorman212.. I will try your suggestions.
1 mechanics told me to change the distributor cap/rotor, the other told me to clean the throttle body. AutoZone told me to change the sparkplugs & NAPA told me to change the coil.
For those confused, the car simply will NOT start when it is rainy, rains or just finished raining outside. I am a female, this is my first Honda. I am NOT dating a mechanic, therefore, I have to go to a forum & ask questions to the best of my knowledge. Going to AutoZone is costing me more money & the 2 mechanics I took my car to, are of no help. I'm sorry that I confused anyone w/my post.
Thank you XCR600 & poorman212.. I will try your suggestions.
#7
09-05-2011, 09:18 PM
We all started somewhere with learning this stuff, no matter if male or female. Someone helped me learn so I try to pass on what I can.
As to your starting problem, It is most likely water is getting into one part of your ignition system or another. Most likely is the rotor cap. Loose fit, bad seal, a small crack that is hard to see, all lead to moisture getting in under the cap and shorting the spark out. No spark = no start. So that mechanic was on the right track in my opinion. The rotor is one of those might as well things while your changing out the rotor cap.
Same can be said for the coil. A coil is really just that, two coils of wire, one inside the other with a very narrow spacing between the coils. If there is a crack in the coil case or a space where the wires go into it, then moisture can get inside and short the two coils. Again, no high voltage electricity going to the distributor to send to the plugs, so no spark= no start.
Plug wires can also age and get cracks on the insulation letting water or moisture into the wires, shorting out the spark. Again, no spark = no start. But with wires you typically get a bad miss on the engine rather than a no start at all.
All of these symptoms of these bad components can disappear when the wheather is dry, or after they have time to dry.
As to the throttle body, I am not sure I see where that would be wet wheather dependant.
As to your starting problem, It is most likely water is getting into one part of your ignition system or another. Most likely is the rotor cap. Loose fit, bad seal, a small crack that is hard to see, all lead to moisture getting in under the cap and shorting the spark out. No spark = no start. So that mechanic was on the right track in my opinion. The rotor is one of those might as well things while your changing out the rotor cap.
Same can be said for the coil. A coil is really just that, two coils of wire, one inside the other with a very narrow spacing between the coils. If there is a crack in the coil case or a space where the wires go into it, then moisture can get inside and short the two coils. Again, no high voltage electricity going to the distributor to send to the plugs, so no spark= no start.
Plug wires can also age and get cracks on the insulation letting water or moisture into the wires, shorting out the spark. Again, no spark = no start. But with wires you typically get a bad miss on the engine rather than a no start at all.
All of these symptoms of these bad components can disappear when the wheather is dry, or after they have time to dry.
As to the throttle body, I am not sure I see where that would be wet wheather dependant.
#8
09-06-2011, 01:50 PM
Happens when its raining or very humid; that suggests failing insulation on the high-voltage side of the ignition system. Distributor cap, rotor, plug wires, or sparkplugs themselves.
Leave the car so it's completely cold & do this test when it's dark. Open the hood, start the engine, & turn off all the lights. Look for arcing around the distributor & sparkplug wires. Even a dull blue glow indicates a component with failing insulation. Spray water from a windex bottle & see if that makes it more visible.
You already changed the cap & rotor? So I'd expect those to be OK. Maybe the problem all along has been the wires? Anyway if you see any fireworks that'll tell you what to replace.
The coil is located inside the distributor. Not visible for this test, unfortunately. You can probably find discussion about testing the coil with an ohm-meter. That's only one part of the test. If the insulation is breaking down in the coil, it can still read OK with a normal ohm-meter. The test meters that would check insulation breakdown aren't cheap so normal mortal backyard mechanics don't own them.
Leave the car so it's completely cold & do this test when it's dark. Open the hood, start the engine, & turn off all the lights. Look for arcing around the distributor & sparkplug wires. Even a dull blue glow indicates a component with failing insulation. Spray water from a windex bottle & see if that makes it more visible.
You already changed the cap & rotor? So I'd expect those to be OK. Maybe the problem all along has been the wires? Anyway if you see any fireworks that'll tell you what to replace.
The coil is located inside the distributor. Not visible for this test, unfortunately. You can probably find discussion about testing the coil with an ohm-meter. That's only one part of the test. If the insulation is breaking down in the coil, it can still read OK with a normal ohm-meter. The test meters that would check insulation breakdown aren't cheap so normal mortal backyard mechanics don't own them.
#10
09-06-2011, 07:44 PM
Hey, I wasn't knocking, I was going with the joke (hammer, screwdriver). That is why I gave the suggestion of using a spare plug (~$3 dollar investment vs a timing light or other tools). My collection of tools started with much the same, as time and money came along it grew.
I asked about the o-ring under the cap as a source of the "water" getting into the ign system......
The comment about sparying cleaner directly into the throttle body was to try to narrow down if it is a lack of fuel vs a lack of spark......spray cleaner and it starts for a few seconds, fuel issue. If not then def an ign issue.
Sorry if anything in my post came off wrong.....I don't think it did but want to be sure.
I asked about the o-ring under the cap as a source of the "water" getting into the ign system......
The comment about sparying cleaner directly into the throttle body was to try to narrow down if it is a lack of fuel vs a lack of spark......spray cleaner and it starts for a few seconds, fuel issue. If not then def an ign issue.
Sorry if anything in my post came off wrong.....I don't think it did but want to be sure.
