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-   -   Tranny?? Engine??? Electronic?? --- Something's wrong!!! (https://www.hondaaccordforum.com/forum/general-tech-help-7/tranny-engine-electronic-somethings-wrong-15128/)

falkore24 01-04-2008 11:05 AM

Tranny?? Engine??? Electronic?? --- Something's wrong!!!
 
Hey all!!! I've been having some problems that seem serious, but I'm not 100% sure ..... or exactly what it is. Below is a string of PM's that Sir_Nasty and I have written to each other. Please offer advice or testing ideas as I'm drawing a blank.

************************************************** **********************

FALKORE24:

first, you should know that the high temp dropped 20 degrees in the past 2 days, so that may have caused some of this.

When I got back to my car around 7:30 last night, I auto-started it from the bus like I always do and when I got past the 3-way merge to get out of the park and ride it was a notch or 2 from full operating temp (~80% warmed up). I pulled onto the highway with a lot of room to speed up slowly, but it wouldn't. It seemed like the descriptions I've read of "limp home mode" ..... basically operating normal with very little gas and VTEC seemed to be locked out ..... I pulled over to let it warm up for another minute and then it behaved like it normally does before it's fully warm, kinda like the choke is set too high. I got up the hill and it was fully warmed up, then some guy in a 5th gen accord got cute and cut off the SUV in front of me across the white stripes on the service road exit ..... knowing that he planned to rip up on the left lane to cut off the Odyssey in front of the SUV, I fealt compelled to humble him (car's running right now). So I got on his ass and he jacked over in front of the Odyssey thinking he could box me out to the exit ..... lol, blew his doors off!!!

Leter on last night, I went out for a bite to eat and it went into limp mode when fully warmed up. After a few pumps of the gas pedal, it went back to normal ..... once while acting screwy, the rpms climbed to 5k with no power.


Recent work:

Dec. 1 :New lower engine mounts
Dec. 24 :New side engine mount and torsion damper
Dec. 27-30 :4x tranny fluid change + oil change


Any ideas??? Any possibility that a bad tank of gas could cause any of this? Is my tranny dying?

___________________________________________

SIR_NASTY:

for the rpm's to climb that high with no power sounds like a slipping tranny, since you've done the fluid changes have you checked the levels? first thing I would do is pull the tranny dipstick and smell it... If it was limp mode you should have a CEL which I'm assuming you don't....

___________________________________________

FALKORE24:

No CEL, but it did come on for a second .... I plan to get the codes read tomorrow. It was weird..... I think the tach bounced (maybe water in the gas?), and it did rev some, but I don't think as high as the tach read. I'll check the fluid level tonight, it should be a little high ..... I shorted the 3rd change a third of a quart and put it in the last change, so 3.33 qts total on the last change. With 7.6 qts total it's only a 5% overage. Other than it acting up yesterday, it drives fine ..... before and after.


____________________________________________

FALKORE24:

Last night, as I left the park & ride while still pretty cold, it definately fealt like a tranny slip, but that was the only time. After I got home, I had to go out shortly and the car was still not fully warmed up when I got back in ..... for another 2 minutes. So at this point, I am taking it easy and just driving normal ..... no slip. I got on the highway, no problems .... hit a U-turn and got back onto the highway near my park & ride and did a rolling (~5 mph) launch. It redlined 1, 2 and I let off in 3rd, no problems! This morning, going to the P&R I got onto the highway (6 lanes total, left at a light to get on) and hit it from about 15 mph, ripped up no problems (not real hard because of traffic).

Also, I checked the fluid last night ..... it's as clean as it gets and a hair less than an 1/8" above the top hole (intentional as noted).

____________________________________________

SIR_NASTY:

If the fluid was fine and didn't smell burnt then I'm kinda at a loss. It's seems somewhat intermitant... Is your coolant and everything ok? any possibility you've got a fuel filter issue?

____________________________________________

FALKORE24:

Well, the fluid is new as of last week (4 changes). I'll check the coolant level when I get to the car .... did 2 vinegar flushes and 5 water a couple months ago. Filled with Peak Lifetime --- the yelow stuff. 6th Gens don't have fuel filters and per HondaDude (I think) the pump screen hardly ever gets blocked, plus I don't think it's a fuel delivery problem since I can get to 7k rpms.

I get the feeling that it is related to the weather and it's not going to resurface ..... or the car just does not like to be driven when cold, and this is going to bug me until I get rid of the car (may be fairly soon, but I don't want to HAVE to get a new car).

____________________________________________

SIR_NASTY:

just for the sake of testing have you considered draining a tad bit of tranny fluid so it right on or maybe a TINY bit low. Perhaps the extra fluid in there when it's cold is thicker and the added fluid give added pressure and causes some issues... Hard to pinpoint right now but since that's the only thing you know isn't on spec you may as well do a quick fix on it...


falkore24 01-04-2008 04:21 PM

RE: Tranny?? Engine??? Electronic?? --- Something's wrong!!!
 
I got the ECU/TCU codes ..... all 7. Here they are:

P0171 ---- Fuel System Too Lean
P0300 ---- Random Misfire
P0301 ---- No. 1 Cylinder Misfire
P0302 ---- No. 2 Cylinder Misfire
P0304 ---- No. 4 Cylinder Misfire
P0305 ---- No. 5 Cylinder Misfire
P0780 ---- Problem in Shift Control System <--------

Thanks KilrSpaz for the codelists on the Accord Wiki & HondaDude for providing the info to Spaz.


klrspz 01-04-2008 04:29 PM

RE: Tranny?? Engine??? Electronic?? --- Something's wrong!!!
 
Which can be found here:
http://hondaaccord.wikidot.com/obd-codes

HondatechAV6 01-04-2008 09:05 PM

RE: Tranny?? Engine??? Electronic?? --- Something's wrong!!!
 
for p0171 and the misfires are most likely from a problem with the fuel pressure regulator/pcm in winter...but have you experienced any hard starts? excessive cranking and thne youhave to hold the throttle open to keep it running smooth?
if not, have you done the egr update?(new valve and port cleaning)
do you have access to a scantool to read live engine data? if so, i'll post some info on sensor readings, etc to help diagnose p0171
p0780 = transmission death. sorry, that code indicates a mechanical problem in teh shift system or hydraulic system. i mourn your loss...

falkore24 01-04-2008 09:34 PM

RE: Tranny?? Engine??? Electronic?? --- Something's wrong!!!
 
damn ... so it's definately shot??? Why is it driving fine then? The lean code, I think has been mentioned to me before ... I can't think when or why, but that one didn't surprise me ...... the misfires I figured were incidental, but the last one means I'm getting rid of the car?!? Well, I guess it's so long 3G.

ckebottle 01-04-2008 10:16 PM

RE: Tranny?? Engine??? Electronic?? --- Something's wrong!!!
 
You're not going to replace the transmission just sell it? Will you get another accord?

HondatechAV6 01-05-2008 01:10 AM

RE: Tranny?? Engine??? Electronic?? --- Something's wrong!!!
 
at the very least you can try to do solenoids...however,most likely there are some metal shavings or clutch material blocking up a few valves or a check ball in the valve body causing an intermittent hiccup. drive it till it drops.

HondatechAV6 01-05-2008 01:13 AM

RE: Tranny?? Engine??? Electronic?? --- Something's wrong!!!
 
i just looked at the pics of your ride! very clean! looks like you have something on the dash - xm radio or some kind of fuel management system?? either way, i like those headlights! are they HID or just halogen behind a projector? do you have a link where i can buy them or something info on them??

falkore24 01-05-2008 09:52 AM

RE: Tranny?? Engine??? Electronic?? --- Something's wrong!!!
 
Well .... on the dash, on the left side I have a Sirius Tuner & in the middle I have a G-Timer and my X50 .... sometimes my GPS as well. I do have a V-AFC controller under the radio.

A friend suggested that it might be a part of the problem, but it's been there with it's current tune for about 3 years ..... I'm going to take it out and sell it regardless.

The headlights are TYC Elegante projectors with a 5000k HID conversion kit.


The strange thing about this whole deal is that right now, the car drives fine! The lean code was old, the misfires could be from a burp, but that tranny code ....... kinda makes me nauseous.

HondatechAV6 01-05-2008 09:57 AM

RE: Tranny?? Engine??? Electronic?? --- Something's wrong!!!
 
clear the codes and wait for them to return, then troubleshoot it. you can try solenoids and cross your fingers.


how is the light pattern on the tyc? does it look good? i was considering doing a hid retrofit into my stock lamps with the tsx or s2000 projectors but i wasn't really happy about the $$ for parts.

falkore24 01-05-2008 11:33 PM

RE: Tranny?? Engine??? Electronic?? --- Something's wrong!!!
 
Yeah ..... I guess that's all I can really do right now. I like the light pattern, but it's not as good as a real HID reflector ...... not bad though.

falkore24 01-07-2008 09:11 AM

RE: Tranny?? Engine??? Electronic?? --- Something's wrong!!!
 
New news: I drove it up to Mountain Creek for some snowboarding with my sister yesterday. One time on each drive, for about 2 minutes we could smell a burnt smell after a tranny slippage. Otherwise it drove fine. I checked the fluid after the second burn smell and it's still pink and doesn't smeel burnt, but it looks like the end. Anyone nearby wanna make an offer?

HondaRacer4Vtec 01-07-2008 10:24 AM

RE: Tranny?? Engine??? Electronic?? --- Something's wrong!!!
 
you can try that tranny treatment stuff form wal-mart, i forgot what it was called, 50slick or something like that. My dad used it onhis 98 accord v6 and when we began to have problems. The car is still runnung and tranny is at 170,000. Aloutgh this is not s permiit fix, it will stall you a great amount of time maybe to save up mopney for the car. I can voch for this little $8 can. you wont notice it at frist but like in 3,000 miles you will. Give it shoot. only $8.

falkore24 01-07-2008 02:00 PM

RE: Tranny?? Engine??? Electronic?? --- Something's wrong!!!
 
hmm...... slick 50 tranny treatment?!? I'll give just about anything a shot, but I don't plan to keep the car for another 3000 miles. 3G is going to be gone in the next few weeks. I'd rather cut my losses than risk dealing with snowballing problems. I got 5 years out of the car and I'm sure the next person will also, but it's time for me to move on.


BTW --- I'm going to swap out the head and tail lights back to OEM ..... they are the only stock pieces that I still have ...... the lights and the VTEC controller will be for sale shortly. I need to look up the parts to figure out the sale price.

HondatechAV6 01-07-2008 06:22 PM

RE: Tranny?? Engine??? Electronic?? --- Something's wrong!!!
 
if you want to drive to chicago i'll do the tranny for free. just get your hands on the tranny and i'll help you out. i can have it done in 3 hours.

falkore24 01-08-2008 09:13 AM

RE: Tranny?? Engine??? Electronic?? --- Something's wrong!!!
 
Wow Hondatech!!!!! Thanks for the offer, but I don't really think the car is worth a new tranny to me ...... someone is going to get a heck of a car after it is swapped out because everything else on this car is in excellent shape, just a few paint marks and some touched up rust.

For me, I've had this car for 5 years and I've maxxed out it's handling minus getting rims for it. I'm ready to have a manual car that is smaller and this is just a kick in the pants to get on that. When it gets a little warmer, I do plan to go to Chicago for a few reasons .... my parent company is there and they want to show me around a bit, my friend from school that got shot at the VT incident is there and I'd also like to shake your hand.

As for the car, I reset the codes last night and none have returned yet, but I did feel a tranny shudder. I'll update this thread as info presents itself. Thanks again for the advice and help!!!

ckebottle 01-08-2008 01:51 PM

RE: Tranny?? Engine??? Electronic?? --- Something's wrong!!!
 
What car do you plan on getting next?

falkore24 01-08-2008 04:58 PM

RE: Tranny?? Engine??? Electronic?? --- Something's wrong!!!
 
Some kind of civic ..... ideally a 90-91 CRX si. After that, I think a 96 Prelude SH ...... but due to the rarity of those cars, I'll probably wind up getting a mid-90's civic hatch to keep unmodded for a year or 2. You have to remember that I hardly drive at all during the week. I figure that I can get a mid-90's hatch and when I'm ready to move on from that, it will have about the same value that I buy it for. The other thing is that even though I drive 10 miles a day M-F, I still need to have a car ..... northern NJ is not NYC.

EDIT: If I could find a 1st or 2nd gen MR2, I'd take that also. 1st gen had the suspension designed by Lotus engineers and the 2nd gen was the poor man's Ferrarri!!! Also sick handling. I'm looking for 1.5 g's on the skidpad.

HondatechAV6 01-08-2008 05:59 PM

RE: Tranny?? Engine??? Electronic?? --- Something's wrong!!!
 
wait...there was a 96 SH? or do you mean 97 SH?(97-01 is the last prelude model)

falkore24 01-09-2008 09:09 AM

RE: Tranny?? Engine??? Electronic?? --- Something's wrong!!!
 
Whoops .... you're right ..... I meant the 5th gen SH's ..... 97-01.

I think that 3rd gen would be in the running too. The 2.0si 4WS.

HondatechAV6 01-09-2008 07:17 PM

RE: Tranny?? Engine??? Electronic?? --- Something's wrong!!!
 
i'm in DIRE search of a 96 or 97+ prelude! i need a fun car to play with! it has to be a 5 speed and i'd prefer to stay away from SH ludes(sure it's nice, but its heavy and a pita to work with) and must be stock.

falkore24 01-10-2008 08:27 AM

RE: Tranny?? Engine??? Electronic?? --- Something's wrong!!!
 
Update on 3G:

I drained some tranny fluid to add some snake oil ..... Rislone flavored. The drained fluid looked and smelled new. From looking under the engine and tranny, everything was very clean and all I found was a bit of oil on the AC Compressor and a small drop on the oil plug. I checked the oil and tranny levels and both were fine, so I don't think I'm leaking anything. I didn't drive the car today.

I still wonder if the problem is the shift solenoid rather than the tranny. It just seems to get stuck in neutral, but I did get limp mode again yesterday before I pulled out of the park & ride. Would the solenoid throw it's own code? I know the ODB2 has codes for shift solenoids A, B & C; but I think that's a standard fault chart and IDK if the codes match the Honda tranny well. What do you think? Is there any chance or am I just dreaming?

HondatechAV6 01-10-2008 06:11 PM

RE: Tranny?? Engine??? Electronic?? --- Something's wrong!!!
 
replace the solenoids and cross your fingers.

sir_nasty 01-10-2008 07:04 PM

RE: Tranny?? Engine??? Electronic?? --- Something's wrong!!!
 
Hondatech, check autotrader.


falkore24 01-11-2008 07:51 AM

RE: Tranny?? Engine??? Electronic?? --- Something's wrong!!!
 

ORIGINAL: HondatechAV6

replace the solenoids and cross your fingers.
Is there a DIY writeup somewhere, hopefully with a few pictures? I looked up the parts and found a bunch of shift solenoids ranging from 30 bucks to over 200. From my reading, it seems that there are 2 solenoids, A and B and that 2nd gear is A-on, B-off and 3rd gear is both on. My problem happens from stop to 1st gear sometimes, 1st to 2nd, and 2nd to 3rd; but it does not shift rough, just gets stuck in neutral. On the ODB2 chart, I noticed fault codes for a shift solenoid C as well. Is there 1 solenoid in particular that acts like a clutch in a manual tranny? If so, this would be the one that I'd hope is faulty (and not the entire tranny).

00AccordLX5spd 01-11-2008 08:50 AM

RE: Tranny?? Engine??? Electronic?? --- Something's wrong!!!
 
How in the crap did I miss this thread? I just now saw it. I'm sorry to hear about your ride bro. I don't realyl have any suggestions. I've heard a few success stories with that Lucas transmission treatment. But, I am kind of like you. It's probably about gone and time to move on.
You still gonna buy that frickin clean CRX?

falkore24 01-11-2008 09:05 AM

RE: Tranny?? Engine??? Electronic?? --- Something's wrong!!!
 
Not exactly sure ..... the KBB value is 1400 and he wants 4250. Also it's a 2.5 hour drive, so if he doesn't budge on the price, I don't think so, but it's still an open discussion, so we'll see. I'd spend 2500-2800 on it I think, but again I'd have to see it in person. If double the book value isn't enough, I can find a better deal ..... I have many others printed out that I didn't show you. I also found a 92 non-si with 83k for 1900, but it's yellow and I'd have to change that (I don't like the "please shoot me with the radar gun!" look). Also a 91 Prelude si with 157k for 2500. The 'lude is nearby too.

We'll see what happens this afternoon when I have my tranny specialist look at it. The Rislone was added 2 days ago, but the car was barely even moved yesterday. Today I drove to an alternate park and ride that is between the shop I am taking it to and my house. The tranny slipped in the first quarter mile of the drive, but not anymore after that. Does anyone know the shift solenoid patterns with respect to the gear? All I can find are the A and B solenoid patterns for second and third gears. Is there a C solenoid? There is on the ODB2 problem code list.


SN: Can you do me a favor and edit that link so it has a tag rather than the web address? I think that is causing the word-wrap problem.

00AccordLX5spd 01-11-2008 10:52 AM

RE: Tranny?? Engine??? Electronic?? --- Something's wrong!!!
 
I thought that was kind of high for a CRX, but the thing is in mint condition with under 100k on it. i don't blame the guy for wanting that much for it. it is extremely hard to find a CRX that has not been ragged out or has a million miles on it.

I still can't believe HondaTech offered to do the trans for free. That is awesome. I wish I had someone around here that had a shop I could go to myself that would let me work on my own car and if I ran into any problems I could ask them to help. My dad's mechanic back where I grew up is like that.

falkore24 01-11-2008 05:21 PM

RE: Tranny?? Engine??? Electronic?? --- Something's wrong!!!
 
It's got 112k. Not getting it. I went to check out a Prelude ..... a half hour later I got a call that it was sold.

Oh yeah ..... according to the tranny expert, the lip seals are shot on my tranny and it needs to be pulled and rebuilt ..... so the car is for sale.

HondatechAV6 01-12-2008 10:11 AM

RE: Tranny?? Engine??? Electronic?? --- Something's wrong!!!
 
where do you live? how much?

sir_nasty 01-12-2008 11:20 AM

RE: Tranny?? Engine??? Electronic?? --- Something's wrong!!!
 
with all the extras you have on your car wouldn't you be better off to just repair the tranny?

falkore24 01-14-2008 08:36 AM

RE: Tranny?? Engine??? Electronic?? --- Something's wrong!!!
 
Aftermarket parts aren't really worth anything in selling the car, besides, I got a deal that I couldn't pass up. The car is going to be traded in to a dealership that plans to auction it. The rear lights will be for sale (custon Nighthawk black painted bezels) along with CF bezels that they came with. Also I will be selling the V-AFC2 .... and even though it wouldn't be dyno tuned, it has a dyno tune from my setup, so it would be close for a 6th gen V6 with I/H/E. I also removed my new torsion damper to use on the new car and I think my bro is going to buy the strut bar from me. I couldn't find my OEM headlights, so unfortunately, the projectors and HID's will go with the car.

The new car is a 2006 Scion TC with a manual tranny. It has a 2.4L 4 cylinder engine that puts out 160HP and 163 ft.lbs of torque. It appears that almost all mods on this car come from TRD with the exception of springs and sways which have 1 or 2 other options. ....... also, who else has a supercharger add-on that maintains the factory power-train warrantee?!? Gonna need that one!

Oh yeah, this car has 16,700 miles and cost $10,000 + 3G with a dead tranny.

Scion tc w/17k miles, KBB = $15,400
Accord w/ 90k miles, KBB = $6400
Accord w/90k miles, Galves = ~$3800

Cost of tranny replacement, by specialist = $2700

00AccordLX5spd 01-14-2008 09:05 AM

RE: Tranny?? Engine??? Electronic?? --- Something's wrong!!!
 
Sounds like a prettydecent deal. Haha I'd probably still try to get them to sell it to me for $9k or so though. When you trade a car in there is always some wiggle room. How much will the SC run you and how much power will it put down? I didn't even realize they made SC's for the scion TC's. I figured turbo would be more desirable since its a 4cyl.
You know we are going to haggle you now for driving a Scion.
You do plan on sticking around the forum still don't you? or have you already made your way to the top ten posters list on a Scion TC forum?

falkore24 01-14-2008 09:29 AM

RE: Tranny?? Engine??? Electronic?? --- Something's wrong!!!
 
I plan to stick around ...... anyone have any suggestions for a tc forum that's not filled with babies and haters?

As for the deal, I think Igot a pretty good price ..... they originally had the tc marked up to 18 and change. It's clean as a whistle .... but the bumpers can use a little love when it warms up a bit.

The TRD superdcharger doesn't make a ton more power, because from what I've read, there are some parts that don't have too much extra strength to handle a whole lot more power. It seems that the car will put down 200HP and 180 ft.lbs with the SC. Also, it maintains all warrantees ..... 3 yr/36,000 miles, full mechanical. In addition, it uses the stock ECU with a flash from a simple tool that they hook up ...... seems fool-proof. I think it's about 5 grand to have the dealer supply and install the SC, but I haven't really looked into it in depth. First I have to learn to drive the thing since I've never owned a manual before ..... just gone through 1st and 2nd a few times in parking lots. I had a friend test drive it for me and that thing can move! More torque than HP?!? Also, it handles well on stock equipment and comes with 215/45-17's ...... gimme a few months and it will have the TRD suspension with Hotchkis sways ..... maybe the TRD 18's too since they have the pressure sensor in them, but they're expensive! It looks like I have a whole $h!+ ton of reading to do to learn about this car and the 2AZ-FE yota engine.

00AccordLX5spd 01-14-2008 09:38 AM

RE: Tranny?? Engine??? Electronic?? --- Something's wrong!!!
 
Hehe, now you know a little about how much faster a manual trans car can seem/be. Can you imagine when I was 16 and had my 5spd 1990 Mustang GT? 300ft lbs of torque! try learning to drive a manual trans on that car.

falkore24 01-14-2008 10:12 AM

RE: Tranny?? Engine??? Electronic?? --- Something's wrong!!!
 
LOL .... right now I don't know crap!!! I haven't even driven the thing yet!!!! I needed a couple days to strip my Accord, so I'm going to pick it up today after work. Thank god the noreaster that was supposed to dump 8" of snow here changed it's mind!

HondatechAV6 01-14-2008 09:19 PM

RE: Tranny?? Engine??? Electronic?? --- Something's wrong!!!
 
$2700...nice... WAIT

what is your vin number? you have a warranty extention on that tranny! it's a 2000 av6, the warranty is 7yrs/9months or 100,000 miles from the original delivery date! post that vin ASAP and i'll check your delivery date~

falkore24 01-15-2008 09:05 AM

RE: Tranny?? Engine??? Electronic?? --- Something's wrong!!!
 
It's 2008 ..... past 7 years any way you cut it .... it was one with the tranny extension, but it's past the extension ...... either way, I think I got a pretty good deal on the Scion ...... oh, and I was wrong about it's milage. It has 15,280 on it.

JimBlake 01-15-2008 11:39 AM

RE: Tranny?? Engine??? Electronic?? --- Something's wrong!!!
 
Yeah, it would have to be leftover really long. First delivery to first actual owner would have to be after January 2001. Still, HAV6 can look it up by your VIN.

falkore24 01-15-2008 11:44 AM

RE: Tranny?? Engine??? Electronic?? --- Something's wrong!!!
 
it's not my VIN anymore


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