1997 Accord LX, 2.2 liter, 4 cyl, 5 spd manual, not a VTECH
Currently has about 170K miles

parts replaced in the last year:
1 month ago:
Shop: Valve Cover Gaskets - oil in the spark plug wells
DIY: Spark plugs & wires - see above

6 months or more:
DIY: Starter - car wouldn't start, pulled starter and tested bad
DIY: Battery - tested bad wouldn't hold a charge - yay for warranties.
DIY: Radiator - top plastic cracked
Shop: Clutch master & slave cylinders & lines

The oil in the damn spark plug wells. I take it in because I don't feel like doing the work myself. The novice tech who got the job called to let me know that I had oil leaking out of the relief valve on my distributor. My face This "tech" told me that I needed to get the entire distributor replaced & not the VCG. He proceeded to quote me $800+ for the repair when I was planning on $120 max.

I told him I brought the car in because of oil in the spark plug wells. I do this about every 15k miles, yes it happens that often. In fact I am near 100% certain that this issue with the VCG leaking all the time is because when I'm lazy and take my car in for an oil change they overfill it and blow the gaskets. This is a notorious issue with Honda's and was dumbfounded that an ASE certified mechanic would try to have me believe that oil leaking into the distributor caused oil to pool in the spark plug wells.

Needless to say I got the manager on the phone, he confirmed I was right that the two leaks were not related. He said I could probably get away with driving on the leaky distributor for a couple more months. He also told me I can not just replace the seal that is causing the leak. Something about they don't rebuild distributors, the seal that is leaking is way inside & they just put in a whole new distributor. I'm thinking, it's probably one stinking gasket that needs to be replaced...

I came in to pick up the car, was told they went ahead and cleaned up the distributor at no extra cost, this is part of the reason I use this shop, they throw in a lot of freebies. The manager then gave me another quote to replace the distributor for $630 this included a 20% manager discount. I'm shopping around for a better price & I've found at least 3 shops who are well under the $500 range.

I'm considering doing it myself and wondering how hard it is to replace the distributor. Since I do not know where to look to see if there is in fact a leak. Could anyone direct me as to where this relief valve is? Also could anyone recommend a cleaner to clean up the years of grime and grit in there? So I can see if there is a leak or not.

Before I do anything, I want to make sure I really do need the repair, and what a fair price for it should be if I don't do it myself. Also it is my understanding that a distributor should last the life of the car, can anyone expand on why mine might be failing after only 170k miles? Is there a specific brand I should look for when purchasing the replacement distributor?

Here's what the car is doing as of this week:
1. Sluggish to accelerate
2. Takes a little longer to start than it used to (like 2 seconds)
3. Randomly during acceleration it feels like a cylinder is misfiring (jerky etc)
4. Idles funny, ranges from 300 to 1k
5. Oil pressure gauge randomly flickers while driving (even after replacing the VCG) and always lights up for a second longer than the other lights on start up. No visible oil leaks either on the engine, underside of the hood, or in the driveway.

No code for a misfiring cylinder comes up when I take it in for the CEL. It does come up with the loose gas cap code. Replaced the gas cap, and have yet to reset the CEL by disconnecting the battery.

I check fluid levels about 1x month and nothing ever seems depleted, so if there is a leak it's really slow.

I always check the spark plugs & the wires after I feel what I think is a misfiring cylinder happening and everything seems to be in good condition considering the plugs & wires are less than 3 months old. Before the last tune up I opened my hood to find the spark plug wire for #3 was completely off the plug & only partially in the well, not to mention covered in oil & corrosion. This is what prompted me to take it in for the VCG.

soo yeah, probably not posting in the right forum, but I would appreciate feedback, suggestions, comments etc.

 

This is the correct forum.

The valve cover gasket and the upper seals should be replaced to stop oil from leaking into the spark plug tubes. There are some lower seals that are harder to get to that can also cause this. Here is the writeup from the DIY section: https://www.hondaaccordforum.com/for...ead.php?t=3088

Here is a thread where we talk about the procedure to remove/replace the distributor: https://www.hondaaccordforum.com/for...ad.php?t=23636

Also, you can download a 94 shop manual from the spooner link I posted in online manuals thread in the DIY section. The 94 is almost identical to your 97.

You can buy that internal seal for the distributor. Go to autopartswarehouse dot com The part number for your accord is W0133-1640599

You will have to disassemble the distributor after you remove it. I just disassembled my distributor, but mine is an EX, and your LX isn't the same as mine. It should be similar.

Here is what I did:

Remove distributor like in the instructions from above. I removed the dist. cap, rotor, and the ICM. I marked the key that inserts into the engine block and the shaft with a marker, to ensure that I didn't put the key back on 180 degrees off. I removed the snap ring and the rod that holds on the key, then pulled off the key. To unscrew the plate that cover's the bearing, I had to unscrew one of sensors. Then I could slide out the shaft and bearing. You can access the seal with that shaft/bearing removed.

 

Thank you for the feedback PAhonda.

I have my manual, although it got soaked in anti-freeze during my radiator replacement. Probably why I haven't used it since. The link you mentioned in the DIY for manuals leads me to a site that requires a paid membership to view any content.

In regards to the VCG you mentioned a lower set of seals that can cause the same issue as the upper seals leaking. So I'm understanding that if the lower seals have never been replaced that would cause the brand new upper seals to leak and seem like the problem has not been solved. I didn't know these lower seals existed or how to replace them. 2 questions: Should I be replacing the upper seals so often, approx every 15k miles? How often should the lower seals be replaced?

On to the distributor. I considered my lack of confidence & proper tools and the fragility of some of the internal parts. Adding to that it would appear there is more than one internal part that will end up needing to be replaced down the line. This further prompts me to go for a whole new distributor rather than attempting to replace the internal seal. All in all it comes down to my lack of confidence in being able to do the rebuild right and have my car back up and running the same day.

In shopping around for a whole new distributor I'm seeing prices in the $175-$250 range online and upwards of $350 in my local parts shops. Lowest shop quote was $380 P&L, I revisited the quote from my usual mechanics and they priced the part alone at $630. This is causing me concern that the other shops either didn't understand that I meant I wanted a price to replace the whole thing or my regular mechanic wanted to install some high performance distributor. I will check around again, but I'm still trying to understand why this one shop would be over $800 and the rest are half that or less.

From the threads you linked it appears that pulling the old and putting in a new one is not all that involved, mark wire positions and remove bolts etc. The main concern being getting the wires on the right positions and not putting the new one in backwards. Would I really need the timing light mentioned in the other threads? Or can I get away with just make a mark at the engine block & distributor to line up later and be ok?

So if I pull the dist-cap off I should be able to see if there is oil inside & how much. I'm guessing any amount of oil inside is not a good thing.

 

upper seals , i would advice to do anytime you have to do valve adjustment ( valve cover is off )or when they leak .upper seals can last 30-60k miles if not more ....if after replacing upper seals there is still oil in plug tubes then you need to replace the lower seals ,, they can last longer and do not need replacing unless they leak ..

As for the distr, if it leaks internally , just replace the lower inner seal like PA suggested, if you cannot do the job a shop should only charge you around $ 100-150 at most for labor ......no need to replace distributor as it would be a total waste of money

 

I think that you went to the service manuals thread and not the online manuals thread.

Here is the DIY thread I mentioned: https://www.hondaaccordforum.com/for...ead.php?t=4597

 

The lower seals don't CAUSE the upper seals to leak. The lower seals are a whole different path for leakage. If you look closely down the sparkplug tubes, there's another seam a ways further down deeper in the tube. Most likely, your new upper seals never leaked. The continued leakage came from the lower seals alone. But just to be sure, you should be careful about installing the upper seals right-side-up vs. upside-down.

The lower seals are #19 in this picture, below the camshaft bearing caps. If you're afraid to dismantle the distributor, then you probably don't want to dismantle all the rockers & valve gear. So this is for your general information when you talk to a shop.

 

PAhonda, deserthonda & JimBlake!!! You guys are awesome! THANK YOU!!!!!!

PAhonda: I looked @ spooner & a couple of other sites to try and find the repair manual I need. I decided to go with a torrent download as this appeared to be the best course to get the exact one I ruined. I'd like to upload it here when I get it. where & how should I post it?
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JimBlake: That picture really helped me understand what I need to look for. I have a friend who is willing to help me do a tune up on my valves. Another thing I've never done in the 100k+ miles I've owned/driven the car So while we're in there doing that I'll go after those lower seals. Wish I had known about them sooner considering the 4 VCG's I've done in the past 2 years. Oh well we learn something new every day.

Is there any indicator on those upper seals to tell me if they're in right side up? I can check them when I go to do the lower ones.
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deserthonda: I knew I've been missing something when it came to my VCG's and the rate at which I was doing the upper seals was just too high. Thanks for putting that in perspective for me. I'll see if I can find a shop or mechanic who would be willing to do the inner seal replacement on the distributor. Or I may just gain enough confidence to do it myself

 

It's been a couple years so I hope I get this right...

The upper seals aren't round cross-section, like an O-ring. The cross-section is flat on top & flat on bottom. The flat on the bottom is wider, & the sides are angled. The narrower part of the cross-section fits into the groove on the underside of the valvecover.

Another thing to check (since you've had the VC off a few times)... Look for scratches or gouges within the groove where the gasket fits. Also on the opposite surface where the gasket presses against. Anything like that would provide a path for leakage even with a new gasket. Probably a little bit of Permatex Ultra-Grey would be good if you find something like that.

 

Oh yeah, did I mention how happy I am that I came here first, before going through with that crazy expensive "repair" hahaha. Thank you for your insight and advice!

Thanks Jim. I'll look for said scratches, I already got a whole tube of gasket goo just waiting to be put to good use.

 

Too much RTV goop will make it a major PITA to get the gasket off next time. Besides, excess goop won't make it seal any better.