Squeaking
#2
09-29-2006, 01:57 PM
RE: Squeaking
it could be something as simple as the upper strut tower damper (the rubber pieces that stick through the top of the inner fender in the engine bay and attach to the strut) being worn or slightly rusted and squeeking... Common issue with Polyurethane bushing kits... you can try spraying some silicone spray around it and that may help.... or it might be the strut itself...
#3
09-30-2006, 05:07 AM
Been Around A Long Time Member
Join Date: Dec 2005
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Posts: 4,754
RE: Squeaking
if i were to tell you replace the suspension part , you would wonder which part ?? and that my answer was not complete correct ???????
well before we can help you with the proper reply HELP US ,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,, what year and model ....?????
Input it in your signature so we all know
well before we can help you with the proper reply HELP US ,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,, what year and model ....?????
Input it in your signature so we all know
#4
10-21-2006, 05:19 PM
RE: Squeaking
Ever since I did a complete front suspension job, I "had" a squeak or a creak whenever I went over a bump. It didn't bother me that much, but it drove my wife crazy.
I replaced the two big main stabilzer bar bushings, lubricated them with silicone grease, and when that did not work, the "sway bar" link bushings.
The creak was still there!
In desperation, I jacked up the car and loosened the bolt/axles on the new, aftermarket upper control arms - the two points where the arm "pivots" within a bushing. I then "pre-loaded" the arm and strut assembly by placing the jack under the lower arm, just below where the strut yoke bolt goes through the arm. I jacked up the lower arm until that side of the car just raised up off the jack stand - making the "rotary" position of the upper arm at those pivot points to be exactly what it would be if the car were on the ground with the wheel attached normally at rest.
Then I tightened the bolts/axles to spec, and lowered the car.
That did it. There was no more creaking whatsoever, no matter how rough, or undulating, the road.
I remember that when I installed the upper arm a couple of months ago I was wondering what position I should put the arm into before tightening those axle bolts, but wrongly decided that this was not important, so I left it tilted down rather low when I tightened it - essentially reaching the steering knuckle so that I could install the upper ball joint stem into it.
Furthermore, I had just installed the new strut assemblies in the car, so the knuckle and lower arm were sitting much lower in the wheel well than they would if the car were on the ground at rest.
When I then lowered the car off the jack, I believe the rubber bushings of the upper arm were "pre-loaded" way too much and this is what almost immediately caused the creaking noise - noise that I at first thought would go away.
I don't know exactly what was rotating on what on the arm, but the sound disappeared and, after I did the other side of the car, handling on undulating roads was very much improved, too. The car was not nearly as "jumpy" as it was before this adjustment.
Even my wife noticed the improvement in handling immediately and without any prompting from me.
When I did the second side, I did not even bother jacking the car. I just turned the wheel to both extremes and reached in the wheel well with a wrench to loosen the appropriate bolt. Once both bolts were quite loose, I pushed down on the fender over the wheel to really bounce the car up and down a few times. Then I just reached in and tightened the bolts. Simple - took me no more than 10 minutes.
I woiuld recommend to anyone who has a suspicious creak when going over rough or undulating roads to try this adjustment first. Our front end is now as quiet as it was on Day 1 of our ownership.
I finally got the alignment done on the car and it really needed it after the suspension work. As a result of the new suspension and the alignment, the car now also handles as well as it did on Day 1.
Fantastic!
I replaced the two big main stabilzer bar bushings, lubricated them with silicone grease, and when that did not work, the "sway bar" link bushings.
The creak was still there!
In desperation, I jacked up the car and loosened the bolt/axles on the new, aftermarket upper control arms - the two points where the arm "pivots" within a bushing. I then "pre-loaded" the arm and strut assembly by placing the jack under the lower arm, just below where the strut yoke bolt goes through the arm. I jacked up the lower arm until that side of the car just raised up off the jack stand - making the "rotary" position of the upper arm at those pivot points to be exactly what it would be if the car were on the ground with the wheel attached normally at rest.
Then I tightened the bolts/axles to spec, and lowered the car.
That did it. There was no more creaking whatsoever, no matter how rough, or undulating, the road.
I remember that when I installed the upper arm a couple of months ago I was wondering what position I should put the arm into before tightening those axle bolts, but wrongly decided that this was not important, so I left it tilted down rather low when I tightened it - essentially reaching the steering knuckle so that I could install the upper ball joint stem into it.
Furthermore, I had just installed the new strut assemblies in the car, so the knuckle and lower arm were sitting much lower in the wheel well than they would if the car were on the ground at rest.
When I then lowered the car off the jack, I believe the rubber bushings of the upper arm were "pre-loaded" way too much and this is what almost immediately caused the creaking noise - noise that I at first thought would go away.
I don't know exactly what was rotating on what on the arm, but the sound disappeared and, after I did the other side of the car, handling on undulating roads was very much improved, too. The car was not nearly as "jumpy" as it was before this adjustment.
Even my wife noticed the improvement in handling immediately and without any prompting from me.
When I did the second side, I did not even bother jacking the car. I just turned the wheel to both extremes and reached in the wheel well with a wrench to loosen the appropriate bolt. Once both bolts were quite loose, I pushed down on the fender over the wheel to really bounce the car up and down a few times. Then I just reached in and tightened the bolts. Simple - took me no more than 10 minutes.
I woiuld recommend to anyone who has a suspicious creak when going over rough or undulating roads to try this adjustment first. Our front end is now as quiet as it was on Day 1 of our ownership.
I finally got the alignment done on the car and it really needed it after the suspension work. As a result of the new suspension and the alignment, the car now also handles as well as it did on Day 1.
Fantastic!
#6
10-26-2006, 02:30 PM
RE: Squeaking
This is the upper arm. (Upside down as it would be installed in the car, though.)
The arrow points to one of the two upper arm bushings and the bolt that passes through it. Obviously, the other bushing and bolt is across from it at the other top of the "Y".
The actual bushings are pressed into the bornze-colored (for lack of a better expression) "eye bolts". The bushing looks very similar to the one below:
You can also see in the first photo the upper ball joint that is installed in the steering knuckle. This joint and the lower ball joint constitute the front wheel's left/right "pivot axle". To hold the wheel in a particular position on that axle, the tie rod end (another ball and socket joint) is attached to the wheel. It is in turn attached to the "rack" of the rack and pinion assembly. The rack and pinion assembly is essentially bolted to the body of the car. The steering wheel moves the rack to the right or left, thus "pulling" or "pushing" the wheels into the desired pivot angle.
One end of the upper and lower control arms attaches to the car via bushings, and to the wheel's "steering knuckle" via the ball joints I mentioned above. The bushings are the wheels' up/down pivot points
When one replaces the upper arm, the upper ball joint on the old arm is first removed from wheel and the upper arm can "flap in the breeze", but the angle of its "rest" position depends on WHERE and WHEN one tightened the two bolts going througn the little steel "pipe" at the center of each bushing when the old arm was installed.
When those bolts are tightened on the new upper arm, the ends of those two "pipes" come into contact with the two inside surfaces of each bushing's black outer end of the "Y" of the body of the upper arm. After those bolts are tightened to spec, the pipe itself cannot rotate against the body of the upper arm.
Also, The OUTER metal "pipe" of the bushing is pressed into the large bronze-colored "eye bolt" I mentioned above. (The "bolt end" of this large "eye bolt" is where the upper arm is bolted to the car, and tightened via two large nuts inside the engine compartment.) So the bushing CAN NOT rotate within the eye bolts, either.
So neither pipe rotates against the metal surface that they contact.
So how does the arm move?
The "pivot" of the upper arm relative to the body of the car is completely controlled through the ruuber that "resides" between the inner and outer steel "pipes" of the bushings. The rubber of the bushing is tightly adhered to the inner and outer pipes, too, so all of the "pivot" in the joint is INSIDE the rubber - through FLEXION of the rubber material itself.
With the arm installed in the car, but WITHOUT the ball joint being attached to the wheel yet, if the two bolts in question are tightened, one can easily see how the upper-arms' rubber bushings work. As one attmepts to pivot the arm manually, the amount of force it takes to move the arm is very small at first, but very very quckly increases to where the arm will no longer move (by hand, at least). Although the amount of "easy" pivot at the bushing itself is quite small, the amount of distance the ball joint end travels is fairly large - large enough, IMO, to encompass the entire range of motion of the strut suspension.
(As far as I can tell there's no surface sliding against any other surface - all rotation is by the rubber flexing. If I'm wrong on this, I hope someone corrects me.)
So obviously, once again, the question is - "where" should the upper arm's "detent", or "rest" position be initially adjusted? That is, when the upper arm is installed, WHEN should those two bolts be tightened - when the wheel is low as the car sits on the jack stand, or when the wheel is high, as it is off the jack stand as it sits normally at rest on the ground?
I have found out through trial and error that if you tighten those bolts when the wheel is low, the bushing will somehow creak. I don't claim to know what's going on, but somehow the rubber is being over-stressed.
When those bolts are tightened when the wheel/arm is at normal "rest" position, the bushings no longer creak or squeak when going over bumps or undulating road.
Wow, a video would have been a lot easier, wouldn't it?
PS, I guess maybe that the other similar suspension bushings (like the one at the yoke/lower arm) should be tightened when the car is "down", too.
The arrow points to one of the two upper arm bushings and the bolt that passes through it. Obviously, the other bushing and bolt is across from it at the other top of the "Y".
The actual bushings are pressed into the bornze-colored (for lack of a better expression) "eye bolts". The bushing looks very similar to the one below:
You can also see in the first photo the upper ball joint that is installed in the steering knuckle. This joint and the lower ball joint constitute the front wheel's left/right "pivot axle". To hold the wheel in a particular position on that axle, the tie rod end (another ball and socket joint) is attached to the wheel. It is in turn attached to the "rack" of the rack and pinion assembly. The rack and pinion assembly is essentially bolted to the body of the car. The steering wheel moves the rack to the right or left, thus "pulling" or "pushing" the wheels into the desired pivot angle.
One end of the upper and lower control arms attaches to the car via bushings, and to the wheel's "steering knuckle" via the ball joints I mentioned above. The bushings are the wheels' up/down pivot points
When one replaces the upper arm, the upper ball joint on the old arm is first removed from wheel and the upper arm can "flap in the breeze", but the angle of its "rest" position depends on WHERE and WHEN one tightened the two bolts going througn the little steel "pipe" at the center of each bushing when the old arm was installed.
When those bolts are tightened on the new upper arm, the ends of those two "pipes" come into contact with the two inside surfaces of each bushing's black outer end of the "Y" of the body of the upper arm. After those bolts are tightened to spec, the pipe itself cannot rotate against the body of the upper arm.
Also, The OUTER metal "pipe" of the bushing is pressed into the large bronze-colored "eye bolt" I mentioned above. (The "bolt end" of this large "eye bolt" is where the upper arm is bolted to the car, and tightened via two large nuts inside the engine compartment.) So the bushing CAN NOT rotate within the eye bolts, either.
So neither pipe rotates against the metal surface that they contact.
So how does the arm move?
The "pivot" of the upper arm relative to the body of the car is completely controlled through the ruuber that "resides" between the inner and outer steel "pipes" of the bushings. The rubber of the bushing is tightly adhered to the inner and outer pipes, too, so all of the "pivot" in the joint is INSIDE the rubber - through FLEXION of the rubber material itself.
With the arm installed in the car, but WITHOUT the ball joint being attached to the wheel yet, if the two bolts in question are tightened, one can easily see how the upper-arms' rubber bushings work. As one attmepts to pivot the arm manually, the amount of force it takes to move the arm is very small at first, but very very quckly increases to where the arm will no longer move (by hand, at least). Although the amount of "easy" pivot at the bushing itself is quite small, the amount of distance the ball joint end travels is fairly large - large enough, IMO, to encompass the entire range of motion of the strut suspension.
(As far as I can tell there's no surface sliding against any other surface - all rotation is by the rubber flexing. If I'm wrong on this, I hope someone corrects me.)
So obviously, once again, the question is - "where" should the upper arm's "detent", or "rest" position be initially adjusted? That is, when the upper arm is installed, WHEN should those two bolts be tightened - when the wheel is low as the car sits on the jack stand, or when the wheel is high, as it is off the jack stand as it sits normally at rest on the ground?
I have found out through trial and error that if you tighten those bolts when the wheel is low, the bushing will somehow creak. I don't claim to know what's going on, but somehow the rubber is being over-stressed.
When those bolts are tightened when the wheel/arm is at normal "rest" position, the bushings no longer creak or squeak when going over bumps or undulating road.
Wow, a video would have been a lot easier, wouldn't it?
PS, I guess maybe that the other similar suspension bushings (like the one at the yoke/lower arm) should be tightened when the car is "down", too.
#7
11-15-2006, 01:31 AM
RE: Squeaking
Tony
Can you do this type of adjustment on the rear suspension? If so, then how?
My car was unintentionally lowered a bit when I overhauled my suspension system and was curious if an adjustment would help make going over bumps smoother.
Thanks,
John
Can you do this type of adjustment on the rear suspension? If so, then how?
My car was unintentionally lowered a bit when I overhauled my suspension system and was curious if an adjustment would help make going over bumps smoother.
Thanks,
John
#8
11-15-2006, 07:23 PM
RE: Squeaking
The rear upper arm is different than the one in the front.
As you can see, the bolts that hold the arm on the car do not affect the tightness or looseness of the bushing in the arm, so, no, I don't think there's anything that can be done on it to possibly raise or lower the car a bit.
I think that the height of the car depends mostly on the length of the fully-extended strut inside the spring and, of course, the length of the damper from the bottom of the spring to the bolt going through the lower arm.
As you can see, the bolts that hold the arm on the car do not affect the tightness or looseness of the bushing in the arm, so, no, I don't think there's anything that can be done on it to possibly raise or lower the car a bit.
I think that the height of the car depends mostly on the length of the fully-extended strut inside the spring and, of course, the length of the damper from the bottom of the spring to the bolt going through the lower arm.
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