Overheating, Stalling Out
#1
03-31-2010, 02:40 PM
Overheating, Stalling Out
1996 Honda Accord EX
5-Speed Manual Transmission
Mileage: 191,364
I'll try to keep this detailed, yet concise... I checked the DIY section but did not find any posts that mirror the problem here:
My girlfriend's Accord is overheating and stalling out. Problem just started yesterday. She came home yesterday and the car died while she was trying to park (we had to push it in to her parking space). She'd only traveled a short distance, maybe a mile and a half between her starting point and our parking lot.
The Key Issue: Shortly after reaching operating temp., the engine sputters and wants to stall. I experienced it this afternoon when shifting in to neutral while slowing to a slowdown/stop.
This morning I popped the hood and started the car without a problem; cold engine started normally, quick. I noticed that neither of the two fans behind the radiator were running. I am not overly familiar with the Accord so I don't know when they start/stop, or if they should run continuously.
I let the car run for a couple minutes before taking it for a slow ride (in 2nd gear) around our complex. Other than the idle running a little high (about 1,300 RPM at a standstill), and the fans not moving, I didn't see/hear/feel much of anything else. I also ran the AC (still didn't hear the fan motors). I decided to take the car out on to the street after cruising our apartment.
On a quiet side street - no traffic. I shifted in to 3rd and then 4th, got up to about 35-40 mph while watching the temp. gauge fluctuate and climb beyond normal. The gauge teetered between the 3/8 and 5/8 mark. Within a minute the temp. gauge spiked and rocked between the half mark and 7/8. This is where it got dicey and the engine wanted to choke out.
I headed back after traveling only two or three tenths of a mile. I slowed and shifted to neutral, and started a u-turn. While slowing to cut the wheel the engine started to sputter, comparable to when you're in-gear but not giving gas **again, I had the car in neutral**. I shifted back in to 2nd gear and gave a little gas, just enough to keep that car moving.
I was able to get the car back to our apartment lot (a short drive, from the initial sputtering point, about 4/10 of a mile at the most). As soon as I dropped the transmission in to neutral to cut the wheel to park, the engine cut out. I was able to coast in to the spot, but that was it.
After waiting an hour or so for the engine to cool back down, I went outside and started the car again. It took about two seconds of turning over before ignition. Normally it will start in half that. I didn't shift in to gear or go anywhere, just wanted to see if it would start.
Through reading some posts here, and searching Google for these symptoms, I have found that the problem could be related the thermostat, and or the fan motors. However, I didn't really see anything that would explain the flooding/stalling symptom.
I drove an '88 Accord LXi 5-speed manual from 1994-1998. When I had an overheating issue with that car, it always pointed to the thermostat, but the engine never stalled out. I would always have to park and kill power until the car cooled down. So I am mystified as to why the engine is sputtering.
Hope that's enough to go on for you to offer some suggestions. Thanks for reading this long list of symptoms.
5-Speed Manual Transmission
Mileage: 191,364
I'll try to keep this detailed, yet concise... I checked the DIY section but did not find any posts that mirror the problem here:
My girlfriend's Accord is overheating and stalling out. Problem just started yesterday. She came home yesterday and the car died while she was trying to park (we had to push it in to her parking space). She'd only traveled a short distance, maybe a mile and a half between her starting point and our parking lot.
The Key Issue: Shortly after reaching operating temp., the engine sputters and wants to stall. I experienced it this afternoon when shifting in to neutral while slowing to a slowdown/stop.
This morning I popped the hood and started the car without a problem; cold engine started normally, quick. I noticed that neither of the two fans behind the radiator were running. I am not overly familiar with the Accord so I don't know when they start/stop, or if they should run continuously.
I let the car run for a couple minutes before taking it for a slow ride (in 2nd gear) around our complex. Other than the idle running a little high (about 1,300 RPM at a standstill), and the fans not moving, I didn't see/hear/feel much of anything else. I also ran the AC (still didn't hear the fan motors). I decided to take the car out on to the street after cruising our apartment.
On a quiet side street - no traffic. I shifted in to 3rd and then 4th, got up to about 35-40 mph while watching the temp. gauge fluctuate and climb beyond normal. The gauge teetered between the 3/8 and 5/8 mark. Within a minute the temp. gauge spiked and rocked between the half mark and 7/8. This is where it got dicey and the engine wanted to choke out.
I headed back after traveling only two or three tenths of a mile. I slowed and shifted to neutral, and started a u-turn. While slowing to cut the wheel the engine started to sputter, comparable to when you're in-gear but not giving gas **again, I had the car in neutral**. I shifted back in to 2nd gear and gave a little gas, just enough to keep that car moving.
I was able to get the car back to our apartment lot (a short drive, from the initial sputtering point, about 4/10 of a mile at the most). As soon as I dropped the transmission in to neutral to cut the wheel to park, the engine cut out. I was able to coast in to the spot, but that was it.
After waiting an hour or so for the engine to cool back down, I went outside and started the car again. It took about two seconds of turning over before ignition. Normally it will start in half that. I didn't shift in to gear or go anywhere, just wanted to see if it would start.
Through reading some posts here, and searching Google for these symptoms, I have found that the problem could be related the thermostat, and or the fan motors. However, I didn't really see anything that would explain the flooding/stalling symptom.
I drove an '88 Accord LXi 5-speed manual from 1994-1998. When I had an overheating issue with that car, it always pointed to the thermostat, but the engine never stalled out. I would always have to park and kill power until the car cooled down. So I am mystified as to why the engine is sputtering.
Hope that's enough to go on for you to offer some suggestions. Thanks for reading this long list of symptoms.
#2
03-31-2010, 03:49 PM
I don't really get the sputtering, but something about the cooling system & fan control logic...
Nearly everyone reports that the normal reading of the temperature gauge should be somewhere around 40%. As you probably know, the fans aren't needed when you're driving (plenty of air moving through the radiator).
When engine is running, and AC is turned on, BOTH fans should run whenever the AC compressor clutch engages. So once the AC is running, they both will cycle in unison with the compressor.
When the engine is running but the AC is turned off, the fans (both of them) should run whenever the coolant temperature exceeds the setpoint of the fan switch "A" located in the thermostat housing. Normally that's about 50-60% of the temperature gauge. In my experience, it has to be a hot day, idling, & sometimes need to block airflow through the radiator.
Check that fan switch A like this:
It's the only switch in the thermostat housing (LOWER radiator hose). Unplug it & jumper the wire with a paperclip. Key ON, that should make both fans run. I don't think the engine actually needs to be running.
After turning off the engine, the other fan switch "B" (located in the upper hose nozzle at the head) is responsible for switching the fan. It has a different setpoint & it only runs ONE of the fans. You can check that by jumpering its wire but that only works for the first 15-20 minutes after turning off the engine. There's a timer to prevent a bad switch from draining the battery.
Other info...
On the end of the head itself (not the nozzles) there's 2 sensors. The one with 2-wires is the sensor for the fuel-injection ECU. Somewhere there should be a table with resistance (ohms) vs. temperature for that one. The other sensor has only 1 wire - that's the sender for the dashboard temperature gauge.
Nearly everyone reports that the normal reading of the temperature gauge should be somewhere around 40%. As you probably know, the fans aren't needed when you're driving (plenty of air moving through the radiator).
When engine is running, and AC is turned on, BOTH fans should run whenever the AC compressor clutch engages. So once the AC is running, they both will cycle in unison with the compressor.
When the engine is running but the AC is turned off, the fans (both of them) should run whenever the coolant temperature exceeds the setpoint of the fan switch "A" located in the thermostat housing. Normally that's about 50-60% of the temperature gauge. In my experience, it has to be a hot day, idling, & sometimes need to block airflow through the radiator.
Check that fan switch A like this:
It's the only switch in the thermostat housing (LOWER radiator hose). Unplug it & jumper the wire with a paperclip. Key ON, that should make both fans run. I don't think the engine actually needs to be running.
After turning off the engine, the other fan switch "B" (located in the upper hose nozzle at the head) is responsible for switching the fan. It has a different setpoint & it only runs ONE of the fans. You can check that by jumpering its wire but that only works for the first 15-20 minutes after turning off the engine. There's a timer to prevent a bad switch from draining the battery.
Other info...
On the end of the head itself (not the nozzles) there's 2 sensors. The one with 2-wires is the sensor for the fuel-injection ECU. Somewhere there should be a table with resistance (ohms) vs. temperature for that one. The other sensor has only 1 wire - that's the sender for the dashboard temperature gauge.
#3
03-31-2010, 03:50 PM
Just having the car overheat shouldn't cause the car to stall out. It might if the heat caused damage to the head gasket or there is a ton of air in the coolant system.
FYI, if a car starts to overheat in the future, turn the heat on full blast through all of the vents. Also make sure that outside air is coming in. It will help cool down the coolant.
When the engine is cold, open the radiator cap and see if the radiator is filled to the top with fluid. Top off radiator if it is not full and start looking for a leak. Are there any spots on the driveway of something leaking?
Both fans do not automatically turn on when the car is started. When the engine coolant get to a set temperature, then the fans turn on. Both fans turn on when you turn the a/c on, so start the car, turn on the a/c, open the hood and see if both fans are running.
Are the maintenance items up to date, like the spark plugs, dist. cap, and rotor? Is the check engine light turning on when you are driving?
You should check for code(s) by shorting the blue two-pin connector under the glove box. Use a thin paperclip or a piece of wire. See: http://www.dhost.info/accordinfo/howto/cel.html Unlike the 94/95 shown in that site, your 96 will only have the two-pin connector under there.
FYI, if a car starts to overheat in the future, turn the heat on full blast through all of the vents. Also make sure that outside air is coming in. It will help cool down the coolant.
When the engine is cold, open the radiator cap and see if the radiator is filled to the top with fluid. Top off radiator if it is not full and start looking for a leak. Are there any spots on the driveway of something leaking?
Both fans do not automatically turn on when the car is started. When the engine coolant get to a set temperature, then the fans turn on. Both fans turn on when you turn the a/c on, so start the car, turn on the a/c, open the hood and see if both fans are running.
Are the maintenance items up to date, like the spark plugs, dist. cap, and rotor? Is the check engine light turning on when you are driving?
You should check for code(s) by shorting the blue two-pin connector under the glove box. Use a thin paperclip or a piece of wire. See: http://www.dhost.info/accordinfo/howto/cel.html Unlike the 94/95 shown in that site, your 96 will only have the two-pin connector under there.
#4
03-31-2010, 05:06 PM
Been Around A Long Time Member
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: In The Desert ( Sahara ? )
Posts: 4,754
http://techauto.awardspace.com/overheating.html
This should help you diagnose issue,,,,,,,,,First off, make sure that t-stat opens up properly
Also , engine will die ( chugs ) and die if overheated bad enough , than it won't restart till cooled down
I do not know if it is a different issue all together that you are having ,, could not tell you till i saw how it acts up ,, hard to do over the net .. :-)
This should help you diagnose issue,,,,,,,,,First off, make sure that t-stat opens up properly
Also , engine will die ( chugs ) and die if overheated bad enough , than it won't restart till cooled down
I do not know if it is a different issue all together that you are having ,, could not tell you till i saw how it acts up ,, hard to do over the net .. :-)
Last edited by deserthonda; 03-31-2010 at 05:09 PM.
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